DigificWriter

I already wanted the show to get 8 seasons because I really like it, but now I perversely want it to get 8 seasons purely to spite all of the 'disappointed darkfriends' out there who are acting like Rafe and his team killed their grandmother.

@Wolfbrother31 The term 'disappointed darkfriends' was coined by 3 of the hosts - all hardcore fans of the novels - of the As the Wheel of Time Turns podcast as both a discussion segment and a way to describe gripes that either they or other people have about the show.

Also, with regards to the claim that Brandon Sanderson isn't 'defending' the show,  nothing that he said in his Dusty Wheel commentary was negative. He expressed his thoughts on things he personally would have done differently and his own personal critiques on the level of 'darkness' he feels has been applied to the show, but, at the end of the day, he made it clear that, while the finale was his personal least favorite episode, he didn't think it was a bad episode, and you trying to spin his commentary into something that paints a negative view of the series on his part is extremely disingenuous.

1 minute ago, TheTuna450 said:

I just watched it as well. He didn't say that he wasn't allowed to consult on episodes 7 and 8. He said that they weren't able to bring him in to consult until shooting had finished because Barney Harris's departure from the show was a huge crisis & they didn't have time for in-depth input while doing massive rewrites, which I think is understandable.

Thank you for corroborating my rebuttal.

2 minutes ago, flinn said:

 I just watched it. He said exactly what I said he said.

I rewatched his comments before posting what I posted, and he did not say the words "I was not allowed to consult on Episodes 7 and 8" at any point during his explanation of what his level of involvement with regards to those two particular episodes was.

8 minutes ago, Hudson said:

Rafe does not understand the source material.

Rafe does not appreciate the source material.

Rafe is not skilled enough to do the source material justice.

All of this is categorically false.

30 minutes ago, flinn said:

 Sanderson just said on the DW that he wasnt allowed to consult on ep 8 because there were so many changes.

That's not what he said.

What he said is that he didn't have an opportunity to read the scripts for Episodes 7 and 8 because of the Covid shutdown and all of the turmoil that was going on behind-the-scenes at the time regarding Barney's departure.

A person's innmermost fears are not always true; in fact, they're quite often completely untrue, but they can still be picked at to cause - or attempt to cause - emotional pain and distress.

11 minutes ago, Deviations said:

And?  Do you think I don't know I'm in the minority here and in general?

If you know you're in the minority, why did you post the following?

1 hour ago, Deviations said:

Exactly!  When a group of people invested in the material don't get it or don't like it, something is REALLY wrong.  The subset of people posting on this forum had the highest probability of getting it or liking it!  The fact that a noticeable amount of us didn't is doubly damning.

For all of the posters on here who are hardcore book fans and are criticizing the show and actively finding things to dislike about it, there are dozens, if not hundreds, of other hard-core book fans who don't post here but are expressing their overall positive thoughts and feelings on the show elsewhere, so there is nowhere close to a universal dislike of the show amongst the hardcore reader community.

There isn't even a universal dislike of the show amongst the people who do post here.

9 minutes ago, Mailman said:

I'm nearly 100% certain that my read is not incorrect

And I'm 150% certain that you're absolutely wrong in how you read that scene because the show clearly demonstrated what was really happening, which I've already outlined repeatedly but will outline again: Nynaeve wrongly claimed that Perrin and Rand saw Egwene as an object to be fought over, and Rand, already emotionally compromised by slowly coming to accepting the reality of being the Dragon Reborn, wrongly validated Nynaeve's erroneous conclusion by lobbing baseless accusations at Perrin.

19 minutes ago, Mailman said:

That is your hypothesis, But having just watched  the scene again its clearly a line the show wants us to at least think about.

 

Nyn says she is tired of them fighting over Egwene like she is something that can be won then immediately looks as if she has spilled a secret she shouldn't have.

Rand then links the date of engagement to the day he started seeing Egwene.

Nyn then apologizes for what she revealed.

 

At the very least this scene is meant to put this love interest forward as a possibility.

Your read on all of this is incorrect based on what the show presented us with with regards to Perrin, Egwene, and Rand going back to Episode 1.

You missed the obvious and correct point of that scene and ended up drawing the wrong conclusions from it.

6 minutes ago, Mailman said:

Perrin being in love with Egwene

 

You have Nyn being the first then Rand linking the day he and Egwene started dating to Perrin engagement with his wife

Perrin isn't in love with Egwene, though.

@Jaysen Gore I have an intricately researched familiarity with the nuts and bolts of television production, actor contracts, and how narrative focus for a TV series ends up being conceived, and can therefore say with confidence that Rosamund Pike being positioned as the Series Lead and primary main character is not, as you put it, a 'misdirect'.

4 minutes ago, Mailman said:

you have 2 separate things linking the accusation

Genuine question: what are you referring to here?

@Jaysen Gore Moiraine is unlikely, IMO, to be absent from the TV series at all unless Rosamund Pike asks to be released from her contract.

IOW, we'll continue to see what's happening with her onscreen even if narrative events lead her to make an apparently fatal heroic sacrifice.

11 minutes ago, Mailman said:

Im not sure you can dismiss this from the TV show as easily as that Rand also got involved and actually brought up the the specific date of Egwene and him getting together as same day that Perrin became involved with his wife.

Which is an accusation that was completely baseless and that Rand only made because he was emotionally compromised on account of trying to slowly reconcile himself to the reality of being the Dragon Reborn.

5 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

Like others, on first watch I was put off by what I thought was a "triangle" with Eg, Rand and Perrin, but on re-watch it definitely seemed like Nyn making a mountain out of a mole hill.

It really shouldn't have taken a rewatch for this to be obvious, but at least you got to the correct conclusion eventually.

I fully expect that we will get a different handling of Moiraine's overall storyline relative to the novels due to the fact that Rosamund Pike is the series' Lead and will remain so unless she permanently leaves.

2 minutes ago, UOweTamASword said:

I said they haven't thought things out as far as Jordan did.

There's absolutely no way for you to know how much planning has been done for the series unless you're actually affiliated with it.

Based on what little we were shown with regards to Perrin and Laila, I think there's a strong implication that Laila had withdrawn in on herself because she'd had a miscarriage.

5 hours ago, CanisNoir said:

Perrin's wife is at home in the forge jealous of Egwene, having not gone to her Braiding Ceremony. 

We don't know why Laila didn't go to Egwene's Women's Circle Initiation.

8 minutes ago, Mrs. Yojimbo said:

Until that moment, I hadn't seen anything that implied that Perrin had feelings for Egwene

Good, because you weren't supposed to.

The point of that argument wasn't that Perrin had always secretly been in love with Egwene, it was to show Nynaeve Jumping to false conclusions (just like Lord Agelmar had when Moiraine and the group arrived in Fal Dara) and prompting an already emotionally compromised Rand to lash out with baseless accusations.

44 minutes ago, Daenelia said:

No one owes you your own version of the story. And no one version of the story is objectively the correct one

* chef's kiss*

This comment needs to go on a giant banner.

The show chose to use the tools of visual-medium storytelling to depict Mat as a troubled young man with a bit of a dark streak, and used the brokenness of his home life as an Impetus for him being troubled and embracing the darker aspects of his personality. 

Its not my place to determine whether or not these decisions and the changes generated by them were necessary because I'm not the one who made said decisions.

I would also add that it's possible to disagree with the narrative choices that were made without calling into question the viability of those choices or the integrity of the people who made them.

Just now, Yojimbo said:

Or maybe some of us are saying that they feel like unnecessary changes because they are so poorly done.   

The subjective quality of how these changes were implemented has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not they were 'necessary'.